Aussiedistiller, Home Distilling, Moonshine, Home Brew

It won't matter how much acid you use, copper is inert to acid, only the oxide, sulfide (not sulfate) or carbonate layer will dissolve. Once you're left with clean copper, the acid won't touch it. Copper is inert to acid because it is less reactive than hydrogen in the reactivity series of metals.

But doesnt the sulphate get formed from the copper? So you are effectively losing the copper?

Yes but only the copper sulphate layer, and yes I recon if he keeps doing it every run they would eventually disappear, even at once a week he should get years out of them

My question is, would heating the solution on a stove top introduce more oxygen to the process and increase the wear as some type of oxide may happen ? Not a chemist either 8-}

Probably not oxygen but certainly the rate of reaction between the copper sulphate and the citric acid. So heating the cleaning solution to 65-75C for an hour or so with the copper immersed should decrease the total time needed.

Copper Sulphide has only copper & sulphur but Copper Sulphate- has Copper, Sulphur and Oxygen

It would be interesting ta weigh packing over time and see how quickly the copper is being lost,some of my copper mesh packing has lasted 10 years or so befor it needs replaceing.cheers hillzabilly ;-)

Your wish .... I have a set of scales which will measure down to 0.1 grms so I will keep a record and post later.

The other thing I have noticed is without stripping runs or ifn using turdbos,copper packing is harder ta clean and will take longer as well,its a good reason to strip or be patient with clearing and feed ya still the best wash possible.cheers hillzabilly :handgestures-thumbupleft:

All true, I use a T500 and have limited mobility so I have abandoned the idea of de-tuning the T500 and doing stripping runs, but am now getting a very passable result by double stilling and using very clean copper mesh and saddles for the second run. That's why I first asked the community for the best copper cleaning method. :-D

The other thing I thought may speed up cleaning with copper saddle packing would be the use of a small tumbler ,they are used for polishing gemstones and jewellery,with small ones able to be made or bought ,say a kilo plastic screw top jar with the saddles or packing and ya citric acid mix ,then you sit it on a small set of powered rollers and let it tumble away until clean and polished.cheers hillzabilly ;-)

Good idea. I think they are also called cartridge case tumblers, but have not been able to access one yet.

I thought vinegar with salt was the way to go. Cleans it up in a second or two. Rinse. Then rinse In a very mild solution of baking sofa and water. Then rinse again. All up takes a minute or so. Why is this not mentioned in the previous posts - is it considered to be too aggressive? :?

I have mentioned vinegar and salt in another thread, get a plastic (fuck did I just say plastic) soft drink bottle, put ya copper saddles in, add a bit more vinegar than is needed to cover them, put in about 1.3 cents worth of salt ( coupla tablespoons) and shake the shit outa them. Cleanest copper you will ever see and all in seconds, about 20 that is. I have noticed after I have done this that the surface of the saddles seems to be pitted, don’t know if it is the cleaning procedure or erosion from the reaction of the sulphates, either or, pitting means more surface area which is good. Would be interested to see if you could use the same procedure with mesh, use one of those juice bottles with a wide neck, but I suspect a lot of the cleaning action with the saddles is the fact that they are hitting against each other. Arismac, you seem to be an experimenter, give it a go and let us know, I don’t use mesh, so I can’t try it.

This isn’t just about saddles.
One can not put a 500g roll of copper mesh into a coke bottle

The Stig wrote:This isn’t just about saddles.
One can not put a 500g roll of copper mesh into a coke bottle

That’s why I sugggested a wide mouth juice bottle but 500g would make it difficult. Couldn’t it be cut up? Probably more work than it’s worth but would be interesting to see if a small amount of mesh would clean up with salt and vinegar and a shake then go from there with ideas of how to do a large amount of mesh.

Plenty of options, a fermenter would do in a pinch

That sort of aggressive shakeing is going ta destroy the structure of the copper mesh and compact it to a smaller volume,wich needs a different approach than saddles.cheers hillzabilly ;-)

Plus the salt isn't likely going to make its way into the middle of the mesh as easily as the outer so it'll take even longer to clean, and you'll have trouble telling when you've cleaned it enough. You'd be better off just soaking the mesh.

Grab one of those plastic bottles of flour from the baking aisle. It holds about 1kg of flour. A 4" roll of copper mesh will easily drop in.
You don't need to shake it aggressively, just end for end it. The salt easily dissolves in the vinegar, unless you put loads in.
If you don't want to use plastic, grab one of those cheap glass tube bottles they sell for putting spag noodles in, or one of the cheap clip-top bottles that look similar to Fowlers preserving jars.
Or use a Fowlers preserving jar.
Just rinse it well later.
I cleaned my copper saddles by putting them in citric acid dissolved in hot water at 1tsp/L and let it gently boil for about 15 minutes. It cleaned up a bit, but was still noticeably tarnished. I washed them and dropped them into vinegar and salt, brought it up to a gentle rolling boil and they were shiny again in under 5 mins.

Greg.

Thanks Greg. I am going to try ALL the methods that the community has suggested in this thread. I need to clean both copper saddles and mesh both new and used. I will report on which is best, easiest, most cost efficient and any noticeable difference in spirit from the T500. As has been said before "watch this space" ...

Ravvin wrote:Grab one of those plastic bottles of flour from the baking aisle. It holds about 1kg of flour. A 4" roll of copper mesh will easily drop in.
You don't need to shake it aggressively, just end for end it. The salt easily dissolves in the vinegar, unless you put loads in.
If you don't want to use plastic, grab one of those cheap glass tube bottles they sell for putting spag noodles in, or one of the cheap clip-top bottles that look similar to Fowlers preserving jars.
Or use a Fowlers preserving jar.
Just rinse it well later.
I cleaned my copper saddles by putting them in citric acid dissolved in hot water at 1tsp/L and let it gently boil for about 15 minutes. It cleaned up a bit, but was still noticeably tarnished. I washed them and dropped them into vinegar and salt, brought it up to a gentle rolling boil and they were shiny again in under 5 mins.

Greg.

Salt & vinegar - Make sure you kill the reaction though by bi-carbing. otherwise it will oxidise very quickly. Then rinse.