help with 3 inch stainless vm cm design

[Moonshine man]

I want to start building my first still, and would love any advice, suggestions, concerns etc.
This might look a little extreme for a first build but I figure it might as well also be my last. My logic is there’s no point fucking around.

I want to make a 3 inch vm/lm combo. The build will be all stainless except for the top condenser and the packing, which will be copper, and the water lines which will be plastic. I’m using stainless because I can buy it cheap and have access to a good workshop to get all the work done easy. Also I like the lack of maintenance of stainless, and I’ve never really worked with copper much.

We will plasma cut a 3 inch hole in the top of the keg and weld on a 3 inch male connector.
The column, t piece and head will be 3 inch 316 grade stainless.

I will get 6 inches of 3 inch 309 grade stainless turned down to male and female thread. These will be cut into 1.5 inch lengths so that a male coupling can be tig welded to the top of each section and a female coupling to the bottoms. This way all sections can be separated for packing and cleaning. Also the head can be attached straight to the keg for a pot still or stripping runs, and the VM section can be left out if I don’t want to use it.

The colmn will separate into 2 pieces in the centre. Packed column length of maybe 1500mm (59 inches)?

The take off line will be 309 grade stainless ¼ inch hydraulic line with a compression style screw on connector which can easily be moved from ball valve to needle valve as needed. I don’t think I will ever want to use both at once. This will have a liebig type condenser.

For the VM take-off, 1 inch threaded pipe will be welded to the side to make a threaded T for the stainless ball valve. I know this sounds difficult but the right tools are there. Would I be better off with larger diameter, like 2 inch? Also, would this be best to come off horizontally or at an angle?

The head will be a typical Boka dual plate style with either a bought neddle valve or one made from a small stainless T piece using the motorbike spoke design. The top condenser will be the usual dual coiI type. I am not sure what diameter copper pipe to use for this nor what length I would need to make it.

I will put the thermometer inlet below the bottom slanted plate.
I will put 2 centreing rings in the column, one above the packing and one half way up at the join.
The heat source will be a large propane burner.
I hope this makes some sense. I’m still very new to all this. Thanks for any advice.

[MacStill]

Geez mate you been doing some homework :mrgreen:

I think instead of threaded fittings you would do well to check out tri clamp connections, they really are the ducks nuts for convenience and not at all expensive. As long as your going to use copper packing you might as well build the whole thing from SS, and you can get annealed SS tubing for a condenser coil too.

I would also think about putting temp probe on the VM take off, if you did this you could get away with the slanted plates for you heads/fore shots removal and it would work pretty good in pot mode if you up the LM take off to 3/8 inch.

As for the VM side of things I'll leave that to other members who can point you in the right direction there ;)

Sounds like a pretty serious and well thought out build.

Keep us posted as she progresses.

Cheers.

[reknaw]

Bloody hell you are going all out :D She'll be a beauty when she's finished. With your coil you'll be going either 1/4 or 3/8, can't offer you any advice on length for 3 inch. I got some 3 inch stainless today, I am going to have a 2 inch arm coming off the side of it with a 15 inch condensor in 1/4 or 2 1/2 in arm with a 3/8 condensor. One thing that'll help you out is packing in the guts of your condensor to increase efficiency if you need it.

[R-sole]

Sounds a good plan. you're takeoff should be horizontal, 1" valve is big enough, i would definately use copper for your condensor, it has a much better heat co-efficient and will knock down vapours more efficiently.

I have a feeling my coil is about 180mm long, but i'll measure it next time i'm out in the shed.

[Moonshine man]

Hey thanks for all the advice. You guys are pretty awesome.

Yeah Im looking into the tri clamps. I thought they were a bit shit but I guess not. If I can get them for the right price then I will use them but the threaded connectors are nice and free.

I might just chuck in connections for 2 temp probes. I can always just block one up if im not using it.

I'll up the sizes for the LM and VM take offs too.

I'll look into all the suggestions and come back with the tweaked design.

[MacStill]

With the slanted plates you'll want to leave about 20mm gap in height between them, I found this to be a huge improvement when stripping in pot mode and it helps to stop choking in reflux mode.

The original design on HD is a bit flawed in this regard, but that's just my opinion and others there might disagree ;)

Any updates?

[bradsgonetrekkin]

Any more work done on the still msman?

You also mentioned in your intro that TIG isn't a worry. I've finally got my arse into gear with most of my own still parts. Any chance if you are any good at TIG copper to stainless welds could you help me out with a few ss to copper joins for my build? I can get a hand to do brazing straight copper to copper but my Dad in law isn't confident with ss/copper. I can pm you if you like.

[Moonshine man]

Hey all,

I dissapeared for a while but I am back and I finally have lots of stuff! All the shiny 316 stainless. 3 inch, 10mm, 2 inch, triclovers, ball valves, and we'll start knocking it all up tomorrow.

Bradsgonetrekkin I can't actually TIG at all, but I have a mate whos great at it and is happy to help in exchange for booze.
If you havent got it all sorted yet Ill ask him tomorrow but I think he'll probably be happy to help. He's out at wingam. Ill PM you over the next couple of days.

So the new design is as follows:

still design 4.jpg

4 vertical sections, all 3 inch triclover connections. 2 inch VM take off to 1.2m long shotgun condenser. All is 319 stainless except top condenser which is copper.

The shotgun condenser was originally going to be vertival, but on an angle it can be attached closer to the keg without hitting, and gets output further away from the burner. There will be 5 or 6 10mm lines 1.2m long inside 2 inch pipe. The 10mm stainless pipe has a wall thickness of 1.6mm, which looks heaps thick, but with 6 metres of cooling I dont think it will matter.

As for the LM takeoff valve, I had a couple of these laying around which I am hoping will give fine enough adjustment. http://www.weware.com.au/productinfo.asp?ID=144 It works much like the home made needle valves shown on homedistiller, with a tapered bung that plugs a tapered hole as it is screwed in. I'll probably use it vertically as is shown in the picture with the threaded end down.

I have no idea what to use for the propane burner. As you can probably tell, the still is designed towards not fucking around. any suggestions? Theres the 100k BTU burners at BCF for $170 but that seems pretty steep for something that just lets gas burn.

To keep the prices down I bought all the materials in full lengths so we are making 3. A mate has claimed one and we will try sell the third one if anyone is interested.

thanks for any advice. Ill take plenty of photos of construction and post them here.

[R-sole]

Suggest making sure your centerers are removable in case they don't work.

How long is your packed column?


I'm putting an order in for gas burners to china next week if you want some. You can build your own custom burner cheaper than that.

Down the bottom of this thread...

viewtopic.php?f=33&t=284

[Moonshine man]

Those burners do look nice. I was concerned that the jet style burners might not have enough fine adjustment down low. Sorta just designed to run at 1 temp well. But yeah as I said I have got no clue. What is the heat output of those burners?

Im going 1.2 - 1.3m packed column, with triclover half way up. And yeah I will make the centrers after and they will be removable, just sit in held into place with the mesh.

[R-sole]

I din't know actually, but i have asked. If it's known i'll pass it along.

The way to get adjustability would be to build like the cast iron burners, in sets - either round or square with adjustable taps (small ball valves) on each ring. I'm using !/2" ball valves to control my cast burners and they work fine, 1/4" would be better though (and cheaper still).

I'm keen to see one of these going and was going to build one for myself, but ran out of time.

The jets have an 8mm thread.

[bradsgonetrekkin]

Good to see you are pregressing with the build moonshine man. Look foward to seeing some pics.
Yeah I'm still keen to find out about the tig if you chat to your mate.
Happy to barter from some oaked corn whiskey, cash or whatever. Ive also got a fair bit of of 1/4 inch copper coil if you haven't done your coil yet..

[rotten]

I have sent you a couple of PM's with no reply. How much are you chasing for that third still cause it sound like what I am after

[Moonshine man]

We've made a good start and it's all turning out well. More expensive than I was hoping for, but bloody shiny.

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[Moonshine man]

5.JPG

The 3 stills have taken a whole lot of hours so far, but hopefully soon we should have some state of the art stills thet will never corrode and be a pleasure to use.

I think you need to click on the photos to see them properly.